109 | Flow State, Upgrading Core Beliefs, Listening to Intuition & Stepping Into Your Sparkle (The Journey 004) w/ Kimberly Lisi
“We needed to address the little gremlin in my life that was telling me that if I wasn’t constantly pushing and doing, I wasn’t being useful.”
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In this fourth episode of The Journey series, I interview a former coaching client, Kimberly, who shares her transformative journey of integrating coaching with her Plant Path. Based in New York City, Kimberly shares her connection to her intuition, her dedication to the natural world, and her efforts to build a community space for healing. Through her diet with the master plants, Noya Rao and Ayahuasca, and subsequent coaching, she explores moving from healing to transformation and the importance of intuition and energetic flow state.
Together, we discuss the nuances of energy work, the significance of integration, and the interplay between shadow work and entrepreneurial pursuits. Kimberly emphasizes the importance of rest, community, and listening to one's body in the integration process. As a student at Columbia University, she teaches others how to excavate their inner knowing while building her project, HAI House, a community space to offer integrative healing services. The episode concludes with Kimberly reflecting on her ongoing journey and the importance of living a fully integrated life.
Topics Covered:
Kimberly’s story of devotion to the Plant Path
The journey of moving from healing into transformation
Managing city living while being on the Plant Path
How coaching supported Kimberly’s Ayahuasca integration
Coming into coaching when you’re already in an expanded state
Cultivating a genuine connection to intuition
Stillness and awareness as key practices to intuitive living
The importance of sitting with your sparkle and light
Shadow work while on the entrepreneurial journey
Why you need rest and silence during integration
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Things Mentioned in This Episode
Show Links:
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Seven Levels of Consciousness episode (Spotify | Apple | YouTube)
haihouse.org - community integration events in NYC
Where to find Kimberly Lisi
About Kimberly Lisi:
Kimberly's eyes are squarely focused on the future infrastructure of preventative mental health and creating spaces for each of us to further hear ourselves. From ideating brick-and-mortar community-based integrative mental health space, HAI House, to stewarding programs like "How To Hear Yourself", which hone in on exactly how to excavate our own inner knowing as a path to freedom, her life is lived deeply dedicated to the wellbeing and autonomy of our communities.
A born and raised New Yorker currently living in Brooklyn with her 4-year-old son, Kimberly holds a Bachelor of Arts in Clinical Psychology and is currently enrolled at Teacher's College, Columbia University pursuing a Master of Arts degree at the Spirituality, Mind, Body Institute in the Counseling and Clinical Psychology program. Kimberly is a trauma-informed somatic-oriented practitioner focused on collaborating with clients to cultivate the tools to hear their internal direction, which is the only one that matters. She is also a certified Ayurvedic practitioner, Reiki Master, and, most importantly, holds a deep honor for earth wisdom and indigenous plant traditions and practices, studying specifically in the Shipibo-Conibo lineage of Peru.
Looking for a professional coach to support you on your psychedelic path?
Look no further! Along with being the host of the Modern Psychedelics Podcast, Lana is a 3x certified professional coach who works with people on the psychedelic path.
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Lana Pribic: [00:00:00] Hello everyone. Welcome to, I think the fourth episode of the journey where I have some of my past coaching clients come on and share their stories of transformation and how they've integrated coaching with this work of psychedelic transformation.
So today we have the amazing Kimberly with us today. Hi, Kimberly.
Kimberly Lisi: Hi.
Lana Pribic: So good to see you. You're wearing the, those earrings that I absolutely love.
Kimberly Lisi: An homage to you.
I'm so super happy to be here and so happy to be with you again.
Lana Pribic: Yeah. It feels good to see you. It's been quite a few months. So we worked together from January of this year to about April. So yeah, can you, first of all, just do a little introduction and let people know who you are, include anything that feels relevant that you feel will help people understand who you are, anything about like your upbringing or your journey.
Kimberly Lisi: Yeah, for sure. I, my name is Kimberly. I am a born and raised New Yorker. I live in Brooklyn right now with [00:01:00] my four year old son. I am very dedicated to a path of my own inner knowing and intuition and reverence to the natural world. I'm very much on what I call the plant path. So that includes psychedelic medicines, but also just plants as teachers, nature as teachers. And yeah, that It feels like who I really am in this world that we live in. I yeah, like I said, I live in New York City. I work, I'm working diligently to build a community space of healing and integration in New York City. I'm also a graduate student at Teachers College at Columbia in the Spirituality Mind Body Institute.
Lana Pribic: So you did end up going to Columbia. That was something that we chatted about.
Kimberly Lisi: It was, I did. And the story was basically what was going on there when we were having our sessions was hitting me really hard because it was at the time where they're, the school was treating in my estimation, students very poorly [00:02:00] in terms of protest, in terms of free speech and just in terms of keeping them safe.
And there was a part of me that was like, I can't. I can't go there. I can't support. There was a, this protester in me, this activist that was very alive in me. That was just, it was a no. And then I actually declined the acceptance. And we, I think we talked about this. And then it was about maybe three weeks after I declined the acceptance that I was standing at my, my my stove in the kitchen and this just voice erupted out of inside of me that just said and this is a good example of just how I function in general.
I am very in touch with this inner voice and this inner knowing, and I listen to it, and that's the big thing. And so I literally went right to my computer, and I contacted the school, and I asked about reversing the decision, because I knew there was something there for me, and it was something I couldn't see. And then a lot of reflection on that, which we talked about, was around, to these outside voices. There was this activist in me who was active from years before [00:03:00] that, has a different outlook now. That was like, no, you can't do this. This is against everything you are. And then there were outside sort of people in my life telling me the same thing.
But when I stopped and listened to myself, I knew that there was something else there. And I know what that is now, but but yeah, that was all a part of the journey.
Lana Pribic: Wow. Wow. Yeah. Your connection to your intuition was memorable. Definitely. And just like how present your intuition was during our sessions. I definitely want to. Circle back to that before we get into those kind of like details. Can you take us back to nine months ago, January of this year when you reached out to me, where were you at and what was drawing you towards taking on a coaching journey?
Kimberly Lisi: Yeah. So when I actually reached out to you, it was December of last year. And I remember it so vividly because I followed you on Instagram and loved your work and thought you took such a really cool tact about just being a woman. plant [00:04:00] medicines and stuff. And, but then I didn't even know that you did coaching. And I saw something on your Instagram and it struck me immediately. And it said, if you feel like your journey with the plant is transforming from healing to transformation. And I felt that so strongly because, in my experience and my journey with plants and plant medicines, it, there really was a specific point where I was like, wow, my, yeah. Experiences have gone from deeply healing of some major childhood wounding and stressors and traumas to This forward push of transformation and it was almost like a this calling like what you were doing was calling me And I've never done coaching before I've had therapy here and there like I do a lot of sort of internal work And they have a deep meditation practice, but it was immediately apparent to me that This year's particularly some outside support was going to be needed.
So I reached out to you. We had our [00:05:00] initial chat and it just felt right. And then I went to Peru to the Amazon for a traditional dieta in the Shipibo lineage. And I worked with a tree called Noya Rao, the tree of light, non entheogenic, not a psychedelic plant. It's a master a master plant in the Shipibo lineage.
And it was profound and transformational. And we started, I think, I want to say a couple of weeks after I got back
in
Lana Pribic: Yep. Yeah, I remember that. So yeah, that's really interesting that you felt called to coaching because you felt that like you were going from healing to transformation. How did you like, how does that make sense in your mind? What's the difference there? Like, how do you cross that bridge from healing to transformation?
What's the difference between the two for you?
Kimberly Lisi: Yeah. It's such a felt sense. It's really difficult to be specific about the threshold, but I just, I can remember a lot of my ceremonies, like sitting with ayahuasca and even just working with plants in general and my own work. [00:06:00] I would be taken to these places where, I work very somatically, so everything is in the body, and I would be taken to these places in my body where I was holding these things that really needed healing from childhood or from earlier experiences, and those were deep experiences, and they went on for a couple years and then there was just this sort of shift where I started working with plants and I just want to specify when I say working with plants, it's anything from like an ayahuasca ceremony to like when I sit in meditation in the morning, my, my plants come in because I work with them, everything from flower essence to like the herbs I work with when I cook to like very intense plant medicine.
So just to make that clear but there was a point where it started to be more about yeah, what I brought here into this life to contribute to others, to be in service, and the transformation into that. So in my estimation, it's like being able to address some of those wounds that block those [00:07:00] gifts and then taking those gifts and like really just expanding them
And bringing them here.
And so that's what the ship felt like. It's the same line, but it's a delineation of like when you start that push forward.
Lana Pribic: Yeah. Yeah, I've heard it. Absolutely. Okay. before, like therapy gets you out of the hole, coaching gets you over the mountain. And I think like when we look at how psychedelics are talked about in most major mainstream media outlets. It's really focused on the healing and getting people out of the hole, but, they're perfectly suited to getting you over the mountain as well, just as much as getting you out of the hole.
And I love that we're talking about that today because psychedelics truly can meet you. Where you're at that's why I love them so much I want to tangent a little bit here because I just had this question drop into my mind that I just have to ask you because you're a city girl born and raised new yorker it seems that you love living in the city.
I also love city life, which is Really weird for people to hear sometimes when they hear like that you [00:08:00] love plants and nature and sitting in ceremonies So i'm curious for you. Like how do you manage? Manage City living and being in such a hectic environment with following the path of the plants. Yeah.
Kimberly Lisi: day. I said this in our session too, is I have such an, a pull towards the natural world. And I have such a pull towards plants and nature, and it really lives inside of me, and so I wonder, like, why am I even still in New York? I've lived in other places in my life.
I've lived in Australia, I've lived in other, Los Angeles, I've lived in, why am I still here? And it is, I feel, because I have a very distinct purpose here, in cities, where the people are. And I don't think that I'll always live in a city, but the way I'm able to manage it is because I do an immense amount of nervous system work. I do an immense amount of maintaining my energetic flow state [00:09:00] so that when I walk outside, I'm not overwhelmed by the energies. And really, I think when you work with plants and you work with these medicines, they do seed inside of you. They become a part of you. And also let's not forget, we are nature. We bring it. We bring it ourselves. And so when we can tap into that, we can tap into that understanding of who we really are. We can live from that place and it really doesn't matter what's built around us. Um, So for me, I know that my place, and this comes from my experience of Retreats and being in the Amazon jungle and being in these places where I've had these beautiful transformative experiences and then coming back to the city and being like, wait a minute, where's my community? What do I do now? Because I can't function the same way I did. And so my purpose is really in helping people cross that bridge and I need to be here. And I recognize that, but it's a lot of, it's a lot of work in terms of nervous system stuff.
Lana Pribic: Yeah. Yeah. And that's what led you to start HAI house, right? That feeling of where are my, where's my community? Where are my people? And I want to get into that too. Let's [00:10:00] go to the Shipibo ayahuasca diet that you did. And I'm curious how the, I guess like how did the coaching methodology that we use at our coaching sessions, how did that support you during your integration?
Kimberly Lisi: Yeah. So the Shipibo Dieta is like I said, we work with master plants master trees. And the one I worked with was called Noya Rao. They do offer ayahuasca ceremonies, but it is completely up to the dieter if they will participate. I did in a few but it really was about the plant. And what happens is the master plant, you go into deep isolation.
You do not, touch anyone, you generally do not speak, you fast and you go into deep commune with the plant and yourself, and you learn from the plant and you take on its attributes, and Noyer Rao being a being of light and pure consciousness really it is not a thing where you go to the jungle for two weeks and like, boom, you're there.
It is essentially the beginning of a gigantic [00:11:00] process of really excavating that light in you and your intentions with the plant. So, I knew going in that it was going to set off a huge sort of domino effect in my life. I was ready for it. But I also know that before you do dietas like that, they come in and they set you up way before.
So me reaching out to you and knowing I would need a specific kind of support, that was completely this being this diet. That was setting me up and me, my higher self, setting me up for the support that I needed after. Even when I was in the diet, knowing that I was going to be working with you after, I just had this smile on my face knowing that it was just divinely, instructed.
I didn't really know what your process was. I didn't know much about like your training and kind of what you did, but I had full trust that it was going to be exactly what I needed and it really was. I mean, I went into it thinking, okay, cool, let's talk about leadership style. Let's talk about like, let me, let me figure out some stuff about myself that I don't know.
But it was like this deep excavation of my energetic flow state, my gremlins that were holding me back, like the things that were actually [00:12:00] blocking my light. So it was like this immediate setup right out of diet that kind of helps me get the ball rolling on a lot of integration Yeah
Lana Pribic: I work with the seven levels of energy or the seven levels of consciousness. And some are more catabolic, which is destructive and draining. And some are more anabolic, which is constructive. Fueling creative pushes us forward.
You came in at a pretty anabolic state. Like when we did your Eli assessment, I remember you had like your level six and five were really high. It's always. When someone comes in like that, you know, it's always it's a different ball game because for you, it was more of a matter of like, how do we cultivate more of this?
Like, how do we bring this in even more? So I guess what I want to ask you is how did the, Cause people often will think like, Oh well, I don't need coaching. Life is [00:13:00] good. Nothing's really wrong. And that's actually the perfect time to cultivate transformation and change because you're already at an expanded state.
So you have more of a capacity to expand even more and to grow even more. So yeah. Speaking to like the specific place that you were in, not really, Struggling per se with anything too much, but like knowing where you wanted to go and like wanting to see some of the blocks that were in your way that you didn't know, like, how did the coaching journey serve you based on where you were at in the already expanded state?
Kimberly Lisi: yeah, well look speaking of From a level six er at the time ish. Part of it is like just knowing what you need when you don't really know what you need. Like it's there's a part of, I think at least the way I function where it's like I am holding myself, and I'm like a few steps ahead of myself, so I can feel great.
I feel like I don't really need anything, but [00:14:00] like inside when I'm really listening to myself. I'll, I'm going to know what I'm, what I need going forward and what's going to support me. So it's almost like this idea that just listening to those inner voices because they know they're like 10 steps ahead of you and knowing that there's going to be something there that you're not seeing yet.
And so that's what I feel like it was, I came back from a like, extremely transformative experience in the jungle that I could have said like, Oh, I just did this huge, you know, Thing for myself and I'm good for the year. Like I don't need any more expansion. I don't need any more But it's it's about always about integration.
It's always about building upon that right? And so I knew At minimum that there would be some major integration even if I couldn't see it yet and so I almost wish I could answer your question a little more directly But it really is a matter of trusting yourself and trusting that when you see that little thing Whatever it may be.
Maybe someone says something. Maybe it's what I saw on instagram. That's your inner voice telling you that's for you That's for you and to listen to it and to just at [00:15:00] least explore it because that's what it was
Lana Pribic: How, How have you cultivate cultivated such a strong connection to your intuition? Like, how did you get to the point where you came into coaching already at that level six consciousness and what has helped you on your path to listen to your inner voice? Cause. It sounds nice and great, but I know that so many people actually struggle with that and they struggle with differentiating like What's actually my higher self versus what is that like?
Gremlin, how do you differentiate those two and what helps you get connected to it? Yeah
Kimberly Lisi: but most about it is that it's in there for all of us, right? For me. It's been about the dedication that I put into Excavating it Because there's so much stuff in our world now that you can just trash on top of like, this thing that lives in you that's just there, you're born with it.
Nobody knows what you need better than you when it comes to your health, when it comes to your job, when it comes to, nobody. [00:16:00] But we're told, we are basically programmed from birth that everyone else knows better. that you need this extra thing to make you better, that you don't want to feel that pain of that thing that happened to you.
So here's all this TV and all this media to dump on top of it. So for me, when I realized how much I was, was in there and I just needed to trust it, I started with a lot of stillness and a lot of quiet and that's hard, right? Because then you start hearing all the uncomfortable stuff that you don't really want to hear and you don't really want to deal with. And. That was the first step for me, which was stillness, taking away a lot of the distractions and noticing, it's just awareness, like noticing the things that I would do when I was feeling uncomfortable. What I eat, what would I watch? I was five years ago, like I did not miss an episode of the Real Housewives of whatever. I just didn't but because it was something that was really mindless that I could dump on top of whatever pain I didn't want to deal with and no offense if that's something that you know you like to watch But for me it was [00:17:00] the thing it was the thing that I would just dump on top And so it's like a lot of awareness, and then you know the other thing about it was When I talk about how we're programmed this way, we're programmed from birth that what you produce is your worth, right?
So that nervous system regulation, it is rebellion. That's another portion of it that, that I've really been cultivating is that you have to rebel against the system that tells you that your inner knowing is just, you should kind of shoo it away. And, And so like, yeah. There are a lot of practices, a lot of practices that I put in place.
This is something that I'm actually teaching now up at Columbia. It's called how to hear yourself. It's about excavating that inner knowing there are different processes of it. There's leaning on community and nature as allies. There is expanded states of consciousness because for me, Ceremonies and plant medicine have been the quantum leaps in this process of hearing myself and intuition. So yeah it's a very varied process, [00:18:00] but there are a lot of embodiment tools. It's really being able to like, listen to yourself and also feel yourself. Yeah.
Lana Pribic: That's so cool that you're teaching about this at Columbia University. Like I can't imagine a better person to be teaching about connecting to your intuition and your inner voice. How did this opportunity come about? That's so cool.
Kimberly Lisi: Yeah it's, it's interesting. So just to be clear, , I'm a grad student there. I'm not a professor, but in the summertime, we did an intensive with our cohort, and they were talking a lot about how you could volunteer at certain labs at the college, and I wasn't really interested in any of them.
And I was like, okay, what am I interested in? And I did a little research and realized that the School of Social Work had, in the fall, their first cohort of psychedelic assisted therapy trainees. So I reached out to them and I was like, Hey, I've got some experience here. How can I help? I wanted to volunteer, whatever it may be. And so I did a zoom with the head of the project. And what she basically said was that they're working on a [00:19:00] very medical model, which we expect. We expect that schools like Brown and Columbia are going to be working in a very medical model, but what they don't have in their curriculum is presence. And so the concern is that a 25 or 30 year old, who's in a six hour MDMA journey with a client is going to be on their phone, which is mind blowing like wild that wouldn't be something in the curriculum, right? And so we talked about me doing something that, that is an opt in a peer, peer peer to peer. Where we would do embodiment practices for presence and mindfulness and it's, and it's something that I had been working on anyway called how to hear yourself. And it really came from a lot of our work.
It was birthed from our work truly because a lot of it is about finding your energetic flow state. Cause that's where it all comes from. And so this is something that we are now in the fall semester and we're expanding into with even like the spirituality program, the clinical and counseling program, being able [00:20:00] to offer this to students so that they can excavate that inner knowing as a leader in their work with other people.
Lana Pribic: Okay. That's awesome. Congrats. So cool. So cool. So you have HAI house going on still you're at school as a student and then you're also doing how to hear yourself.
Kimberly Lisi: Single mom.
Lana Pribic: being a mama yeah, I'm being a single mama and doing your psychedelic work. Yeah, this is what like a fully integrated life looks like.
I love it. I love it. So you've mentioned the energetic flow state a few times now. So what did you learn about the energy of flow versus the energy of force during our time together? What do you know about that, that you can share with people? Yeah.
Kimberly Lisi: from the one where I cried the whole time, one of my most memorable coaching sessions with you was where I came in and I was like, I have all these thoughts about flow state because when I was in the corporate world, which I [00:21:00] was for 15 years working with literally like celebrities, millionaires, billionaires. That was just where I was. I was working as a chief of staff, I was working in high end property management and my flow state consisted of, like first thing in the morning knocking out a to do list of twenty things, like just getting stuff done and getting it done quick and getting it done precisely and being, feeling really good about that and feeling like that was my flow state.
I was like getting all this stuff done. But just being so productive. Immensely drained at the end of the day, and really in the end, not feeling like I was accomplishing anything great because I wasn't doing anything for anyone who really needed anything. But the flow state at the time was this thing where it's like, and it's how a lot of people feel.
You get up, you sit at your desk at eight in the morning, you work till six. And if you aren't productive every single second, like you're a failure. And so I was, I came to you and I was okay, this is what I know as flow state. And now I'm in a situation where I [00:22:00] have reorganized my nervous system. I don't work in that capacity anymore. It took me two years to get out of that corporate world and realign my nervous system. And now I'm working on HAI house and I've got this to do list, but I just, there are certain things on the list that I just can't move myself to do until it's ready to be done. And then I'll do it. And what I was finding was that, and what we talked about was the flow versus force, where it was like, I knew that if I spent my mornings in ritual and in reverence and like sitting at my altar and in meditation and just in stillness, really. That I would get done , in maybe two or three hours, the same thing that I would get done over the course of eight hours in, in my other world. So it was like, it was about putting your system in the place where it needs to be to get the optimal thing done and to get the thing done that's ready to be done now. So it goes back to that trust that, like what. What time it is and what time it is to do a certain thing and so it's like instead of [00:23:00] forcing everything I have to do this and making your check marks and then just feeling like crap after It's like just really trusting that your body knows and your flow state knows what has to be done And then you feel really fulfilled and some days I would do two things on my list and be like whoa Those are the exact two things I needed to do today to move the ball forward And that was such a huge light bulb because what I would do is try to still and I would feel bad like I would sit at my alter and feel great in the morning about my meditations, but then I would be like, but I'm not at my computer. I'm not like doing stuff. And I feel like a lot of people feel like that. And that's where the nervous system work is rebellion because we have to rebel against this idea that if we're not sitting at our desk at 9 o'clock with coffee, we're doing it wrong. So I love that. Session and that realization and it's a practice because I have to go back to it still now all the time and Promise myself that giving myself time for quiet in the morning is going to be the best thing for everyone
Lana Pribic: Yeah, I love that. Cause yeah, flow is, [00:24:00] it's not necessarily something that you do. It's something that you are, it's something that you are being right. We talked a lot about this idea of being versus doing, and there are, things that we can do to create the conditions for flow, for you, that means sitting in silence and reverence in the morning that creates the conditions for you to access flow state and to be in the flow, looking back.
What was blocking you from being in flow? What did we need to address there?
Kimberly Lisi: Yeah, we needed to address the little gremlin in my life that was telling me that basically, if I wasn't constantly pushing and doing I was You know, I was You I wasn't being useful and there were, there was a lot to do with, I think, Oh I, I remember writing this down. It was like, what was pushing the flow?
The flow was being pushed by unconditional love because when [00:25:00] I would do something just to do it, cause I thought I had to do it, it was linked back to this belief that in order to be loved, I had to be creating
something or, or doing something for someone else. I had to be productive. I had to be productive. Right? That's how I get love when I'm productive. So it really is all entwined with these like deeply held beliefs. And so when you can excavate those, I feel like you really find out like what's true for you because those are deeply held beliefs that we have to address to, to get to what's underneath it. And so for me, that was a huge one that, you know, love was a big part of it.
Lana Pribic: Yeah. Everything you're saying here is all characteristics of level six energy flow state, unconditional love tapping into the wisdom and intuition. Right. Um, So good. What are, cause you talked about beliefs and excavating those beliefs that were standing in the way of your flow. What are some core beliefs that you have now that support flow in your life?[00:26:00]
Kimberly Lisi: I am valuable exactly as I am. No matter what I am doing or accomplishing I actually don't have to do anything to be , .
Just, Just valuable right now. I do not have to be perfect to be loved. That was a huge one for me to really bring into my body. Not just say, that's not a mantra, that's, you bring that into your bones. You do not have to be perfect to be loved. Yeah, those are some really deeply held beliefs and, and, and also like one that I really am working on now that, that is so continual for me is that vulnerability is the true path to finding your people and finding the real love in your life. Because those are the people who are looking for you, who are your real family, are the ones who are only going to recognize you You're in a vulnerable state when you're in a real state of who you are and you don't have your armor up.
For me it's like a constant reminder that you're only going to attract the people who are looking for you when you are [00:27:00] who you really are.
Lana Pribic: Yeah. Those are really powerful. It's interesting. there's so much science and research and books and things about get in the flow and be in flow state and like biohacking and supplements and all this stuff that you can take, which yes, surely help. And it's also so valuable to look at accessing flow state from like this energetic perspective from this Angle of belief systems and looking at like, how is your belief system creating thoughts and emotions that create an energetic reaction in your body that lead to the results that you get?
So let's look at these core beliefs that are like ancient and old and served you at one point, but don't necessarily serve you anymore. Let's look at those, question them, challenge them and upgrade them to Be aligned with where we want to go, right? If I want to live a life [00:28:00] of flow, what are the beliefs that support that?
Yes. I don't have to do anything in order to be loved. I am worthy in love just as I am. Like that just feels so, like I can just feel the spaciousness that opens up for all the things, right?
Kimberly Lisi: Yeah. And also I think for me, it's been a big realization to not bypass the things that naturally make you feel sparkly. Like what naturally really just lights you up. It might not make you money. It might not bring you a claim or a crowd around you, but what makes you feel really good and everybody talks about a side hustle or making this your gig or whatever.
It doesn't have to be that, but what creates the sparkle and then just sitting with that. And I think in our last session, we talked about something that was so cool. It's we always talk about sitting with the feelings, sitting with the emotions of anger or sadness or like, and that's all really important.
But like sit with the shit that makes you feel good, sit with the things that make you feel sparkly, [00:29:00] sit in your wind, sit in the things that, You know, like savor that stuff because we sit in the mud so much sit on top of the lotus too because they could stop it's that when you're expanding the vessel You can feel both so much more and so it's enjoy both of those and I actually sat in an ayahuasca Ceremony a few weeks ago, and it was really about The plants were just asking me to like to revel in the work that I've done.
And I had at one moment, it was just kind of like, just like lay down for a while and feel that the, the joy of the work that you've done. And I got to just really rest and it was blissful, slumbery rest, and it was a gift and it was a reminder. It doesn't always have to be really hard.
Lana Pribic: Yeah, that's beautiful. There comes a time in everyone's journey where you're asked to confront your light as well. Like, I feel like doing [00:30:00] medicine work, we're always confronting our shadows and looking at the limiting beliefs and wanting to improve and wanting to be better. And I also remember having a ceremony where it was just like, just take a moment to pause and celebrate yourself and look at how far you've come.
I was just at a music festival this past weekend. And it was like Sunday and they were playing this amazing reggae. It was just like, it just filled my heart up with love. And I was just like on the dance floor and I started crying and I was just like, wow, I'm actually genuinely just so happy in this moment.
And it's like those moments of acknowledging and validating yourself and how far you've come. really set the foundation and give you strength to get through some of those more challenging times. One of the skills that I hope all of my clients walk away with is the skill of acknowledging and validating yourself.
Cause it goes such a long way. So I'm so happy to hear that you were able [00:31:00] to do that in a ceremony. Yeah. Yeah.
Kimberly Lisi: work are we doing now? I haven't sat in, in months and it was just like, Hey, you get your best. Yeah, it was nice.
Lana Pribic: Yeah. Can you tell us a little bit about being on the entrepreneurial journey and what that's been like and what it's been like to step into that and do all this shadow work along the way and confront yourself and confront your I guess your areas of growth. What's that been like for you?
Kimberly Lisi: Yeah, it's hard. I think everybody knows that it's hard entrepreneurially and I think it's also a testament to something else that we talked about which is that, You don't have to know everything, you can learn along the way. And that was a big, that was a big one, because a
lot of times, especially for me, it was like I can't go and do this, because I don't know all of it yet. And that was a part of what my gremlin was telling me you don't know all of it yet, but also like, it's really scary to be vulnerable and tell everyone about it, so like, why don't you just not [00:32:00] do it? And that's what you come up against. And the entrepreneurial journey, I think, is as much a shadow work journey as anything. Right? And it's these beautiful kind of peaks and valleys of like, hey, I've got this beautiful idea that I think could help so many people. And then it's like, okay well, here's the reality of like, how it's actually going to come about. And you don't get to know. You just get to ride the waves.
And the only life raft you have is this belief that this is what your purpose is. And if you can hold on to that, and if you can fall back into, to the surrender of that, everything will be fine. But if you can't, it's going to be really hard. And like, that's what it's been, especially this year.
Like I told you, before we started recording this is that I've, I have always had to learn my lessons really hard. And I think like, whoever is guiding me in this life knows that and my plants know that. And so For even this summer like I had to fall back into some past Work to keep me afloat But everything is parallel.
So nothing happens for one reason everything. [00:33:00] It's like yeah This is going to keep you afloat but you're also going to learn some lessons that you need to go back to and so i'm so happy that I did it and it was beautiful lessons, but like I think for me the other thing is don't be afraid to You This is another beautiful thing that I remember you saying is that you're, there's no going back because you're always going forward. So sometimes we have this idea that I can't go back to that because I'm failing at this. Failing is being an entrepreneur because I have to go back to this lesson.
But you're not. It's always a forward trajectory because maybe going back is just the next lesson you have to learn.
So that was great.
But going back to your question Yeah, it really feels like entrepreneurialism and shadow work is the same thing. But and it's Yeah, it also teaches you a lot about the strength that you have And the strength in your purpose and like what you're really trying to do for me It's strengthened even more that I know what I have to do and I know that when I lean into my energetic flow It's gonna come it's gonna
come as long as I don't force it
Lana Pribic: Yeah, I love that. [00:34:00] I remember we worked a lot on receiving. You were in a big fundraising
Kimberly Lisi: Yeah
Lana Pribic: and it was just like kind of funky and not happening and just a lot of stuck energy around it. And we uncovered this block around receiving and asking for help and receiving not just money but help and what that means about you.
If you're asking for help, what do you remember about that? Yeah,
Kimberly Lisi: it was a huge flip in the
business too, because like originally when we started working together, it was like equity partnerships thing. And it was attracting in the weirdest energy. It was attracting in, I just, and we talked about it, but like very off, Brand energy and, but it was a message, right?
It was like, okay, if you go about it this way, this is what you're going to attract in. And so I flipped it. And we became the HAI house became 501c3 [00:35:00] fiscally sponsored because really in the end, like it is about creating these community spaces that are integrative. But it is also then turning that back into the community who can't even fathom being able to afford things like this, like mindfulness based stress reduction, clinical therapy, psychedelic therapies, ceremony work group circles, body work for integration.
And so like putting it back into the community in that way. So it became more of a receiving energy. More of a receiving what the community needs and less of a like pushing for the money to come in through a partner who would eventually want a certain return at a certain time and it just felt like this very sort of masculine not flowing energy.
And yeah so the whole thing flipped on its face and that was in our first couple weeks, which is awesome. But then it reflected back into me and like, where is my ability to receive as the steward of this energy that was the space. And so I learned a lot about that. [00:36:00] Then that was wrapped up in some deeply held beliefs of, if I am open and vulnerable about what my purpose is and what my true desire is. that it will be rejected. It will fail. I won't receive love. So it was all wrapped up in the same. It's amazing kind of when you unravel some things, how much everything else unfurls. So it was beautiful to be able to pinpoint with you what those things were and how they sewed up a lot of other things. Yeah.
Lana Pribic: crazy thing is how unconscious these things are, that like these beliefs are that are running the show for us, that
Kimberly Lisi: Mm hmm.
Lana Pribic: Aren't aware of until we're aware of them. And then, wow, then we're aware of them, but yeah. What? What changed for you? Like how, what's your relationship with the energy of receiving now?
Like where are you at with that? Like, how do you receive? How do you work through that? What's your perspective on receiving?
Kimberly Lisi: Yeah. Other than, so I believe in shifting perspective, but I also believe in [00:37:00] putting into place tools. So leak, even as something as small as like at noon, every single day, my phone sends me a Ryan reminder that just says receive.
And what, no matter what I'm doing, I get up, I go to a window or I stand outside and I literally just allow the energy of the universe to come into
me.
It's something as simple as that really, because you're embodying. the energy of receiving. And so that's something that I do daily now. And then in, in general, I feel like, especially living in a city environment, we're always like in this weird kind of sheltered, like when's the last time you let somebody open a door for you or you did that for someone else.
And so just it's little things in my life
that I'll allow more receipt, receipt for. And then just in mindset it's really more about, you can't receive if you close yourself off. So for me, it's a lot about sharing, a lot more about what's in my heart and what's in my soul and what my values are, and then allowing that to be received.
And [00:38:00] then, you just receive the energy back. So it's all reciprocal. It's never just about receiving it's, it's,
Lana Pribic: I love that you brought in this idea of allowing people to receive you, but people can't receive you if you're not being you. And that's how I don't know how much you remember of the 10 disciplines that you work on outside of our coaching sessions, but that they're all so connected, right?
The authenticity piece is so connected to that because if you're not truly being yourself, you're not truly present. You can't be in the flow and you can't allow others to receive you at all. There's always this beautiful moment, if we're lucky when I'm working with a client where things just, it all just starts to come together, how it's all connected.
And yeah, just as you're speaking, I'm seeing how it all connects for you. So it's really beautiful.
Kimberly Lisi: Yeah. And there's, there are so many ways where I can't see how it's connecting, but I also really trust that,
And that's and it hearkens back to like me reaching out to you to even do [00:39:00] this work because like somewhere inside I knew these were links that things I was going to have to see that I wasn't gonna be able to excavate myself. And so I required, someone with the exact thing that you have expertise in to help me do that. And it's like really trusting in that stuff. And I think it's something as simple as, like I said, like. When something tweaks you a little bit, when it gets your attention, we're trained to just be like what was that?
That was nothing. That was a coincidence. It's not.
It's you. It's your inner self, even if it's the smallest thing. And that, we talked a bit about this too, but this really related for me with nutrition. What you put in your body is It's just as important as what you put in in an emotional level, in a spiritual level.
And I would know if there were certain things I was having cravings for or if there were certain times where I really needed to tap in and hear myself. My body would maybe not want that much that morning or whatever it may be. But it relates to everything in your life. It relates to the movement. It relates to like sometimes if there was a message [00:40:00] trying to come through to me It would come through when I worked out
and so it's like really knowing yourself in every facet
Lana Pribic: Yeah. There's this foundational principle that we learn at IPEC. The world is a perceptual illusion, right? The world is what you make of it. The world is as you perceive it to be a lot of the time. So yeah, that's really powerful stuff. I love how seriously you take integration and even HAI House is built as like a community support system for people who like come back from retreats and no longer have access to community and the, there is a focus on integration there if I'm not
Kimberly Lisi: Yeah.
hi is h a i it
stands for healing and integration
Lana Pribic: Okay. I didn't know that. Okay.
Kimberly Lisi: So h at healing and integration. They're the main things. It's like it's basically, you know, if you think about Anywhere you live in the world, if you are looking, if you're on a healing journey, or if you even, you're just struggling and need some help, right?
What do you do? You go and you're like, you're in a fragmented landscape. [00:41:00] You don't really know where to find the right therapist, because there's so many options out there. And now there's so many modalities from EMDR to IFS to somatic experiencing. You don't really know where to find that. And then you're like, okay, where's my actual community of like minded people? And then where is that sound bath that really kind of electrifies me inside, or the movement class, or the breath work, and then, maybe it's like a women's circle, or, there, there are so many elements that are so fragmented in our community, you don't really know where to go, and for me, the real future of mental health is having hubs in each of our communities where all this stuff is just, it's vetted, it's laid out for you, It's in a place that feels like a home, not a clinical setting,
and there's biophilic designs, you've got plants all around, you've got proper air circulation, and this is where, this is why I'm still in a city,
because this is the stuff you can't find in cities.
Right now it's like we've got such fragmentation and most of the time even if you've got a [00:42:00] good job, you can't really afford therapy. It's so the model and design of it is really in my estimation, the future of mental health. And it is why I was led back to Columbia because I'm in a spiritual entrepreneurialism program that is helping me build out in all the, my blind spots, what this looks like in a city in a physical 3d reality.
Yeah.
Lana Pribic: High House have a physical location?
Kimberly Lisi: Not at the
Lana Pribic: out spaces?
Kimberly Lisi: at the moment. I am running community circles integration. I do how to hear yourself that internal excavation
one on one with people. But really it is about building the community now and then, building out the 10, 000 square foot space
Lana Pribic: There is in person events though in New York City. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. People should definitely sign up for that mailing list that you have and learn about the events. What's your take on integration and just your approach to it? How do you see it? Why is it important?
Kimberly Lisi: I think it's non negotiable. I think it's [00:43:00] actually the main bit of work. For me working, I've been working with plant medicines and in ceremonies for four years now. And those have been like the boulder movers, right? But the actual real like movement in my life has been around my own personal practice that comes from them.
It comes from integration. It comes from, and also preparation, like your expectations prior. Yeah. For me, integration is everything and it is really hard to do without community. It's hard to do without being able to latch on to allies, so community and also the natural world. What is your relationship with nature?
What is your relationship with, the sky and the earth and the sun and the moon? And who can you talk to? And then how can you take these, these, these learnings from these transformative experiences and make them into something real in your life. And sometimes those learnings aren't ripe to be in your life for a year later or years, or it's kind of an ongoing thing, right? Because when you're [00:44:00] integrating, you might pull something back from a ceremony you had two years ago that's now ready for integrating. So it's just a really expansive way of living life.
It's like integration is. is forever, but there are also like segments of it. Like you can feel when a certain integration is coming to a wrap.
Lana Pribic: yeah.
Kimberly Lisi: Yeah,
Lana Pribic: Yeah. Yeah. What, what words of advice do you have for people who are navigating integration and how to make the most out of it and like really just, yeah, go fully in on it.
Kimberly Lisi: rest,
Rest and silence and community. Those are my three things. I think in the beginning it's like anything if you work with a trauma specialist and you go through something really difficult, like a death, they'll tell you for the first six months, don't go to therapy. work, move, right?
Because you're in shock. And so your body is trying to integrate what's going on. And then afterwards is when you start talking about it and trying to make sense of it. So it's the same with really transformative experiences. You're moving the same type of energy in your body.
So [00:45:00] give yourself rest. The first rule of integration is always rest and space. So allow the space that you've created in your experience to let your body process and give you the information.
And I always say like, people think they have to meditate. You don't have to meditate. You just have to find what stillness means to you. Just find that and practice that. That's really, I think one of the main
points of integration. And then for sure community people that you know who you can talk to about it and know who you can not talk to about it.
Lana Pribic: What makes stillness and rest so important during integration?
Kimberly Lisi: Because the body is the king, queen, prince, commander, everything. So the body is doing the work before you're consciously doing the work. So allow it. Allow it the space to do the work. And the rest and the silence will give it the space to do the work. And your body will always give you the information you need at the time you need it.
So if you have silence, you can hear it. [00:46:00] you don't have the silence and if you're covering it over with stuff and if you're immediately going back out into your life just the way it was before, you're just going to put a lid on the, beautiful thing you're cooking up.
Lana Pribic: Yeah. Yeah. Beautifully said. Yeah. You're very like somatically inclined. I would say. I feel like your intuition speaks to you through your body as well. I remember you would sense the presence of certain plants and beings around you and you would get messages from them.
Kimberly Lisi: Yeah.
Lana Pribic: do you think that's because you do the somatic work to open up and receive that?
Is there a connection there?
Kimberly Lisi: I think we all have the capability of getting those sort of messages. For me, it just comes in the form of my plant beings. I think for other people could be a lot of different things. I think somatic work is important for everyone because we're being given this meat, these like amazing technologies of our bodies that we have no idea.
We really have no idea. And and then it's just about how we, what we can do. It's the same [00:47:00] as energetic flow state, right? It's different for everyone. So like, how does it work for us? But so tapping into your body and listening to it or what it needs in terms of movement, in terms of nourishment, it's all different. But I think we all need to really be a little bit more in touch with our bodies because our bodies hold everything. Our brains will shave off the things that are hard or won't make us function optimally, but our bodies code everything. So the questions we have and the things we want to know, our bodies have it.
They've been keeping a recording this whole time, so if we can learn to listen to ourselves and tap into that, all the answers that we need are there. And that comes through silence, and it comes through letting our bodies know that we're listening,
that we're there. Like sometimes even just giving yourself a little squeeze and saying like I'm here with you.
I feel you is powerful Because the information that we need is it's going to come up
Lana Pribic: Yeah.
Kimberly Lisi: So I don't know if that answered your
question at all, but I'm very [00:48:00] passionate about
Trusting yeah trusting the wisdom of our bodies
Lana Pribic: Yeah. Is there anything else that stood out to you about the coaching journey that you want to talk about? Anything that feels like you want to share about?
Kimberly Lisi: I just I think The arc of it is just so beautiful and I everything has an arc, right? I think I feel like I always feel like this with like an ayahuasca weekend. Also, it's like always trust the arc And there are things that you don't know But what I loved about it was I didn't have to prepare for our sessions Whatever was gonna be of importance to come up in our sessions would come up in my literally like in my heart my mind my body just before It was always like what's present right now was what, it was almost like there was a third entity of our, like my higher self, like leading us into what
needed to be done.
And so there's so much trust.
Involved in it, right? That it led me there, [00:49:00] that it led me right to the places I need to. And I even remember that really hard, hard session that I had where I was just like in tears the whole time I was like, and if you'll recall, like I was not, I couldn't get connected. I was like, my normal connection was not there. And sometimes that happens and that's also important to remember for me is that like, You're not always going to be as like intuitively connected as you are. You're not
always going to have the answers. And I think one of the like mantras that came out of our session was when you know, you know, when you don't lay low or let it flow or something like that. And it was almost like, don't stress out if you don't like, you know, you've got yourself. So don't stress out if you don't know, cause it's coming.
And so yeah, that was. There's some really cool mantras that came out of our work, I feel like.
Lana Pribic: When you're in that energetic stress reaction, as we call it in energy leadership, right? When you're [00:50:00] in that catabolic energy, you're literally like under a fog of
Kimberly Lisi: yeah. Exactly,
Lana Pribic: Yeah. So because it's that lower level of consciousness, that lower level of energy, it's not bad. It's not like not good to be there.
It's just a different experience. And when you're in that experience, it's going to be a lot harder to connect. If even possible to connect to your intuition, because that's not the level of consciousness that allows you to access your intuition. So this mantra of when you know, you know, when you're connected, When you don't know, lay low, right?
When you don't know, you don't need to make a decision. Just trust that this catabolic energy just needs to ride out and you don't need to know the answer right now. People always say like, if it's not a fuck yes, it's a no. I always say, if it's not a fuck yes, it's a no. It's either a no or a maybe, right?
Because yeah, it could be a no. It could also be a yes. [00:51:00] Just because it's not a F yes right now doesn't mean it's necessarily a no. You might just not be ready to make that decision yet. I think Knowing how to make decisions in your life is such an incredible skill to, yeah, to cultivate. And I love what you said about, I didn't have to know what to talk about in our session.
It's all about following the energy, right? Follow the energy. Let's go to where the energy is. And I think that's why our time together was so valuable. You were so good at following your energy. And of course I encourage that and create the space for that. And I love when people have this realization during coaching that it's like, Oh, okay.
This isn't like a thing where like I have a goal and like Lana is going to help me like reach the goal. It's more about like, there's a state of being that I want to achieve and to get to that state of being, it requires trusting myself. It requires understanding myself and my energy, and it requires being willing to look at [00:52:00] myself.
And I think you did all those three things.
Kimberly Lisi: Yeah, and I will say it was like, in the very beginning, when you would start the session, you would say, okay like, what's, what do you want to talk about? Like, In the very beginning, I was kind of like, what do you mean, what do I want to talk about? What am I supposed to talk about?
You're the, I was like, you're the coach. But the beautiful thing about that is, which I believe so much, is that we really need to learn more how to trust ourselves. So even if there's nothing prepared and you just, I would just literally sit there with my
eyes closed and say, okay, what's here now? Boom, that's it.
And it's that trust that brings.
And then I started realizing, oh, yes.
Lana Pribic: Exactly.
Kimberly Lisi: works.
Lana Pribic: just like a psychedelic ceremony is training for life, right? The coaching space is also training for life. So just by simply asking you, I'm asking you to empower yourself and to tune in with yourself and see what you need. So yeah, that's always a, it's always a fun lesson for people to learn.
So what do you have going on right now that you're really excited about?
Kimberly Lisi: I'm honestly, I'm excited about getting into the nitty gritty of HAI house, like the business planning right now, what I'm doing in [00:53:00] conjunction with, my work at Columbia is doing some, there's what I think community wants, and there's what community actually wants.
So it's like right now it's a lot of anthropological work on, like, where people are really moving in their healing journey, where where they're really going to, what their needs are, a lot of surveys, a lot of discussion. So it's like getting into the nitty gritty of, like, how it actually creates these spaces.
And that's something that like for me, like I live up here and sometimes I'm like, Oh, I just know it's like my higher self tells me, you have to ground it. You really ground
it. So right now I'm like doing that grounding work. And one of my attention intentions this year was to get really a lot more regimented even in my ritual work.
But this is what's coming through getting a lot more regimented in the business side. I am teaching, like I said, a lot about how to hear yourself and how to like use those embodiment tools to get to that state of just really trusting your internal compass and just hanging out with my little guy.
Lana Pribic: Yeah, he's so cute. Yeah, I love that. So it sounds like you're doing the [00:54:00] 3D human stuff right now.
Kimberly Lisi: Yeah.
I'm always doing the other stuff, but the
3D human stuff is becoming a little
more important to get me where we need to go.
Lana Pribic: Yeah. It's always really like peaceful and lovely. I feel like I'm at that point right now too, where I'm so in the 3d human stuff, like bank accounts and business stuff and launching a new product right now.
And it's like a lot of just
Kimberly Lisi: Ooh, exciting.
Lana Pribic: yeah. And there's like peace around it. I no longer feel the need to escape it. Do you feel that as well?
Kimberly Lisi: Totally. I mean, Really, what's the point of being in these expanded states of consciousness is to bring it back.
Bring it back. And remember the one thing that, that when I was in dieta in the jungle that like the plants were saying is you can go out there. Like they can go out there in an energetic way, but like you can really go out there in a grounded way and bring these messages.
And so that's what it's about. If you're in this world where like you're only in like spirit land, like you're not helping anybody. That said, I am going into dieta in two weeks again [00:55:00] um, which I am excited about. And so I do actually feel like I'm very much in plant world right now, but it's always a balance.
It's
always a balance. Like the point of it is to bring back to the community medicine that is only meant for. Each of us to carry.
Lana Pribic: Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. Last few questions, what would you say to someone who's listening and considering starting a life coaching in conjunction with doing psychedelic work?
Kimberly Lisi: Yeah, I would say if it's something that when you put yourself there in a session with someone and you're bringing your magic is there a sparkle there? Is this something that makes you really feel like, This is your place in the world. This is your purpose. This is what you're meant to be doing. And excavate if there's that sparkle or if there are other elements there, and there can be other elements, but know where your ground is, where your root is in that. Because we just, we all need to support each other. And there are [00:56:00] so many beautiful ways that we can do that. And your gift is obviously helping, To coach people and to help them see their light and also like their blocks their energetic blocks and I would say if that's what someone wants to do Just make sure you're grounded in that sparkle energy that it's meant to it's meant for you
Lana Pribic: Yeah. Yeah. Beautiful. Beautiful. Where can people find you? Where can people find high house? People in New York city, do you have
People can come
Kimberly Lisi: Yeah, so high house dot org h a i house dot org Is where all the info is everything that we create in terms of group circles, we do women on the plant path circles. We do like I said, how to hear yourself in conjunction with Columbia. We do music nights. We do dinner, community dinners all sorts of different things we've done through the summer.
And we'll be offering, I'm not, right now I'm about to go into dieta, so I don't have anything happening in the next few weeks, but we'll start again [00:57:00] in, in fall.
Lana Pribic: Amazing. Amazing. Thank you so much for coming on and sharing your story. I will be following you closely as always and just like seeing what you get up to. Please send updates
Kimberly Lisi: will. It was so good to check in again and go through all of our, because you, by the way, like the notes that you send are amazing after like so detailed and like way better than the notes I took. So going back through them was like a total integration journey in itself.
Lana Pribic: Oh, I'm so glad. I'm so glad. Yeah. All the past guests who have done this before always say that it's like a great integration. You shouldn't. opportunity of the coaching. So yeah. Thank you so much for
Kimberly Lisi: Thank you.
Lana Pribic: your sparkle with the world and just focusing on bringing your true self and your gifts forward in a way that help others.
That's really what it's about. So yeah. Blessings to you.
Kimberly Lisi: Thank you so
much. It's been a beautiful pleasure this year.
Lana Pribic: We'll chat. [00:58:00] We'll chat again soon.
